Ep 88 Goldbacks, a Modern Way to Stock Up on Gold with Jeremy Cordon

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Who is the Guest?

Prior to Goldback, Jeremy always had an interest in precious metals. On a whim, he quit a high-paying job to become one of the first full-time employees of the UPMA (Utah Precious Metals Association). He was able to help grow the organization from 400 members to over 25,000. This enabled him to negotiate himself into his first management position. From there he was able to begin work on his first business, Quintric. This was a gold-backed crypto project where he served on the board of directors. Ultimately this sparked the idea of a gold-backed currency. Quintric did not take off as hoped and after Jeremy’s exit, he quickly started work on the Goldback Inc.

Visit Him at:

Website: https://www.goldback.com/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/goldback/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/GoldbackInc/

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/company/goldback-inc/

Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFhFnqH96KGGuziIzH--EEQ

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Transcript

0:14

Hello, and welcome to another episode of The IDEAL Investor, Show season two, with great guests where we talk about and emphasize cash flow from all kinds of different angles. And today we have a great guest. And I want to tell anybody who is seeing us on YouTube, it says Kevin mates, but it's really Jeremy Corbyn. It's a little technical thing. But Jeremy, welcome to the show. Thanks for having me. Appreciate being here. Yeah, absolutely. And we really, really glad and especially when I researched a little bit what you did, and like, oh, man, I really and I want those by the way, I, you know, at least if they get from the right state. So just to give a little teaser, you have to wait a little bit into the episode of what we're talking about. But before we get there, Jeremy, tell us a little bit. How did you get into what you're doing right now? And then maybe end with what the offerings are that you offer to your clients right now? Sure. So the cold back is a precious metals products. I've been in precious metals for the last eight or so years. And the gold back is really become the most successful precious metals currency in the United States. Yeah, we've sold over $50 million worth so far up into this point, just in the past few years. Oh, that's really cool. So I don't really know many people that woke up one day during high school, I said, I'm going to go into gold. So how was that for you? How did you get into gold? Yeah, there's no real degree at the University for gold. And they certainly don't teach you about gold at high school. Yeah, I kind of stumbled into it, you know, as an internship. And as a capital, as, you know, this attorney side business, he was doing precious metals. And, you know, I was just so fascinated by it. I just started reading everything I could about gold. And it's, you know, sometimes you choose your career, and sometimes it kind of chooses you. I imagine you weren't in high school and you know, deciding to be a podcaster right now. I mean, that was... No, no, exactly. In a sense. I think my story is similar. I don't want to go into it. Because most of the audience knows that for you. I had an uncle who work for Lufthansa and was stationed in Hong Kong. And he was a pipe smoker. Right. And so every time he came to visit, even though smoking wasn't really allowed in the apartment that my family and I lived in, but he for some reason was allowed. So that unka with that smell, and then having the planes and stuff like that actually chose me to go into aviation, right. And I wanted to fly for airlines couldn't do it because of the recession in the early 80s. And it would be coming and aviator in the Air Force. Right. So now, obviously, I retired 20 years ago, and now I do investing. But that's kind of in a sense, it shows me because I thought that was a totally cool thing to be in the world, you know, to work in Hong Kong, and he told me stories about getting a new sick shirt every day, we got the vessel cheap, stuff like that. Okay, so Utah, is Utah, a place with a lot of old mining stuff. I only heard about Nevada being that in the United States, but just Utah famous for them. Yeah, it's our number one export. So Nevada is the number one gold producer in the United States. Next, it's Alaska. And you got to figure Alaska is the biggest state, right? I mean, they have a ton of natural resources up there. But a close third to Alaska is Utah. Precious Metals. I knew about Alaska, not because I know the quantities, but I was for a while a fan of the Discovery Channel show gold rush. Okay. That's helpful to know. So that obviously helped them to even have a chance to get into the industry, I guess, if you're in most other USA says that much gold mining going on? So talking about going back? As I said, I looked at the website, and you said it's the most successful gold backed currency in the United States. Can you tell us a little bit how this actually works? For one? What is it? How can it be used and I also saw that you basically offer for enterprises, I guess, is maybe the best summary term to accept gold back. So I think our audience probably wouldn't know, they know that I recommend 10% of their assets to be, since we do only value assets 10% To be in gold and silver. So going back would be actually one of the opportunities. So tell us a little bit for anybody who has no idea what is it going back to that and so forth. I'll show you why this is 1007 ounce of gold. It's the smallest mass produced gold product in the world to my knowledge, okay, so a 1,000th of an ounce. You know, you're looking at about $4 worth of gold right here. And the reason why people are buying this is the big reason why people buy precious metals in general, are one of the big reasons is, you know, some variation of just in case, right, I want to own some gold just in case. And these are people that have have the experience and know that you know, currencies fail, and they get it with inflation and you know, things get really ugly. You might not be able to spend your dollars, you know, or whatever your local currency is. And I think they have gold because they envision this day and they want to have something in their hands that's going to have that value. And you know, for a lot of people that looks like gold coins. Right now, we came out with gold back, we said, Okay, well, you know, you guys were thinking ahead. But think ahead just a little bit further. Imagine you can't buy anything with $100 bill. Well, now you have a gold coin that's worth $2,000, where are you going to spend that, you know, I mean, who you're going to trade it with, I mean, that's so valuable, there's so much value in that gold coin that it becomes hard to barter with. And, yeah, it's not even to mention the fact that we've got, you know, a ton of these things coming out of China that are fakes. So even if you believe in gold, you know, you can be using a counterfeit coin, you know, even if it's a $2,000 transaction. So the gold back is really about educating people and getting people to use gold on small transactions. You know, we've got 10s of 1000s of businesses that are accepting and using gold backs, you know, where you can go in, you can spend gold, you can get, you know, goods and services. In fact, there's hundreds upon hundreds of businesses that advertise themselves, as preferring to take gold backs over cash. And gold packs have only been out for just a few years, you know, it's really the cutting edge of this technology. So we're starting to see is that people are having a larger portion of gold backs as part of their gold hedge. And, you know, we're selling as many gold backs as we can produce, you know, last month, we sold $6 million worth of gold backs. You know, in the last week alone, we sold over a million dollars worth of gold backs. So yeah, that's very cool. And for those of you in the audience who listen to us in the podcast, and can see what Jeremy held up, it basically looks like a very shiny bill. Like, I don't know,$100 bill, but the dimension is how much larger than the regular dollar bill? This is actually a little bit smaller than $1 bill, it's a little bit shorter, the one gold back. But what's important about it is it's part of an interchangeable series. So this is the one that has a 1,000th of an ounce of gold, that goes all the way up to this 50 here that has 50 times the amount of gold is the one and it costs 50 times as much so it works just like cash. And you can carry these, you know with you and a wallet. In fact, I got one right here where you know, I've got I can carry my goal bags with me and spend them. Yeah, they actually sold out, I went on the website to look at them and go back wallet is currently sold out at least the leather version, I guess. So they're really cool. I just wanted to mention, you know, like, they look basically like a very shiny bill and like a Willy Wonka ticket kind of gold. Yeah. And I've also wanted to just mention the, you know, I've had the pleasure both from a military time and in my business to travel quite a bit. And I think the United States is in the one or one of the very few places in the world where each bill is the same size, which some people find very convenient, because obviously you have a particular size wallet for that. But most other places, they will have different sizes, different colors and stuff. Not every bill is green and just says a different number on it. So I think it is very interesting that you chose to make the gold packs, I cannot I mean, you could have probably made them thicker, but then they might not be as bendable anymore. If they were all the same size. You're exactly right. We were constrained by the technology itself, we couldn't put the amount of gold and a 50 and a one. Yeah, you know, because there's just too much gold, right. And if we did the amount of gold in a one in the size of a 50 you could start to see through it, you know, so it really forced us to do different sizes. You know, the other thing is we wanted to make them as different from dollars is because they're not horizontally oriented. They're vertically oriented. There's women on them, you know, the colors are different. All the different denominations have different colors. It's very cool. And I also fall again for those who will listen to us. I'm not an expert by any means, but I would consider them a piece of art in a way you know. And to your point I think this is a really awesome alternative because the answer that I have always given people who said okay, well like you said earlier a gold coin like a one ounce coin is $2,000 and if the brown mass hits the fan that we were talking about, then it's probably five or $10,000 per coin. How am I going to go and buy a bottle of Coke whether my answer up till now has always been why you should also have some silver coins that might be right now 25 bucks and they might go up to 50 bucks but that's still relatively easy to handle and you know altogether, half ounce coin and stuff like that. But this is I would honestly Jeremy I have to tell you I'm not sure if I could part with them. They look just too too nice to use them back and forth and I'm not so sure if this doors to actually accept them. Do they Give them back or do they just want to? You know what? There is there? You know, I don't I don't know how everybody spends gold backs, you know, just because by by the very nature, these are private transactions. Some of the value of a gold back is if you think about it, I think the reason why gold has been money for 1000s of years in part isn't just because it's rare, it's fungible, or whatever, I think it's because it's so pretty, right? You know, people really like it women really like gold, it's half the gold in the world is using jewelry, you know, people really like looking at gold. And what we've done is we've made gold so thin, you know, with the 1000s of an ounce piece that you can really see all the gold. And emotionally that does something to people, even folks that don't really understand precious metals, you know, they don't understand gold, they don't understand silver, they see a gold back. And there's something very primal that wants that gold back. And if you're bartering with somebody, if you want to have an emergency money, or alternative currency, that's really what you want. You want people to want your money. Oh, yeah, right. Yeah, I totally get it. And I mean, that's why I'm kind of, I wouldn't be surprised if those stores will actually accept them just keep him partially because they're pretty partially, to just said, partially because they could theoretically increase in value, especially if markets get even more unstable than they are right now. Two quick things. In that context. You mentioned that there, I think you said more than 10,000 locations that accept them. Now, is there a place where people can actually go and find out which stores or which kind of enterprises accept goldbacks? Yeah, it's 10s, if not hundreds of 1000s of businesses. So we found is I was hoping that about 5% of businesses would accept gold backs. Yeah. Yeah, I was hoping to get a list together and really kind of prove the concept that, that people would be willing to take gold, right, you know, and we set off on this adventure. And what amazed me, is that when talking to small business owners, half of small business owners are willing to take gold as payment. Yeah. And that's really what I said. So you know, you can extrapolate and say, well, that's it's half of business owners. Yeah. And, you know, Jeremy, I'm so glad that you mentioned this, because it's one thing when I as somebody who helps people invest in value assets says, that's one thing, not only has it been around for 5000 years, and has always been accepted across the world, but when you basically confirming at a small enough reasonably easy to handle a denomination, businesses actually want to even right now, even though they could get dollars, and they all know the dollars are just going to be basically less and less valuable wealth versus growth will always retain certain value with a high probability to going upwards. Now, I mentioned when we did the intro to today's show, that one of the focus areas is cash flow. And you said kind of like, before we hit the record button, there's a little bit of, I don't know if I want to call it a secret, but something that you could tell us in our audience, how they can get cash flow in the context of gold bugs. Can you explain that? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, the old sales pitch with gold is, hey, you know, inflation is coming, it's gonna get Yeah. So instead of holding cash, if you hold gold, you can kind of dodge that inflation. But then you have to do something with that. And I worked at a vaulting company, and people would pay us to vault their gold. So when we launched gold back, I thought, you know, we needed about a million and a half dollars to make the very first gold backs, where am I going to get that I can't really get a million and a half or start from a bank, it's not a valuable enough idea to raise an equity. So we had this problem. And my thought was, hey, you know, we're sitting on 10s of millions of dollars in gold that people are paying us to vault? What if we could give people a return on gold, so not only they own gold, and not only is that gold going up in value, but instead of them paying us we are paying them. So what we've done is we created the gold back lease program, the idea is that you're buying a pile of gold backs. And by the way, gold backs, they've out appreciated gold, they're going up in value faster than gold coins are, you can buy a pile of gold backs and lend them back to the company. And depending on how much you're doing, you're making anywhere from 2% to three and a half percent a year plus free vaulting, you know, so you're really close to that 4% mark, and you get all the appreciation on gold. So you know, this is something I did with my own money back in 2019. I put about$50,000 into the program. And since then the value of the gold back has more than doubled. And I have more gold backs because I'm being paid interest in gold backs. And what we do is we use all those gold backs that we're leasing to make more cycling inventory. Right. So this is this allows us to sell more gold backs, that allows us to grow the business. And really it's a way that you know, we don't have to operate with banks. You know, we don't have to go to the bank and try to get a three $4 million line of credit. I want to say we've got about $16 million right Now, in the leasing program, and with how popular and successful gold backs are, you know, we're actually probably going to be expanding that leasing program from 16 million to 25 million over the next year or so That's basically in essence, like a business line of credit to you, right? It is, except you know, the lease holders, they own the gold backs the entire time, we're borrowing them, so we can use them to sell them and reorder them. So we're always reordering and always reselling. So it's a very low risk investment, and that we don't really own the gold backs, we're doing this with all of that appreciation is held by private investors. And we do this through a subsidiary of ours is called Alpine gold. So if you go to Alpine gold.com, you can do a lease, you can just find one online, you know, you can learn more about the leasing program as well at goldbacked.com. Okay, that's very cool. And when I said line of credit, our mind mended, in a sense for our investors, or for our listeners, our main focus normally is on real estate investing or residential real estate investing in in that context, there's such a thing called a home equity line of credit, which operates similar right you own the property that you go to the bank and say equity in the house and I owe and if you give me money for that, then I pay you interest on it, but only when I use it, right. So it's a little bit more like a rental property. So you know, you own the gold back this and this, you own it, it's yours, but you're renting it to us. Okay, listen, we're paying you rental income on your asset that goes up in value. Okay, very good. Now, to put a capstone on that particular aspect, is there a minimum amount of money that people would have to put in to be in the lease program? That really, I mean, you probably put in a few dollars and start making 2%. But no, no, I meant, like, you know, if you say, Okay, if you want to work with it fine, and become somebody who is doing this kind of almost 4%? Is it 500? Is$1,000? Could it be any any amount. if you're if you're gonna be getting the three and a half percent tear, I mean, you're looking at about a quarter million dollars, you're gonna start at 2%. And then you go up to two and a half at about$50,000 and 3%. Around $100,000. Okay, cool. That's more or less what you're looking at as far as the tears go. But yeah, we have people that put in $5,000, and they can make 2% on that all day. Okay, cool. So now since I'm personally fascinated, I use shipping the void backs other places outside of the US. Yes. So we have distributors on three continents right now. We just started selling them in Poland. Okay. So that's what Europe in Poland that's in Europe, and then we also sell them in Australia. Okay, so if I wanted to get some to my mom and my sister in Germany, then they would come from Poland, I guess. Probably. Yeah. Okay. Very cool. Now, go ahead. Oh, there are distributors that ship worldwide as well. And we have a list of distributors on gold. bank.com. Okay, very cool. So if anybody listens to us, anywhere in the world, you can find a way to get your gold backs? You can find a way to get them. Yeah. Okay, cool. Now, in the context of cash flow for season two, when we first started working with you to set up this particular episode and interview, one of the aspects we said we wanted to touch on, and I'm really interested, because I mean, everyone is trying to figure out where are we going here in the reasonably foreseeable future? We kind of bracketed that to be in an environment of unstable markets. Can you give us a little bit what you have us? Where we are, how much more volatile and unstable? Is it potentially going to get and why you think that? You know, I think the biggest problem that we have in our markets is really just a problem we have with our money, you know, I mean, as we produce more money at the base is all the money that's already out there. And the liabilities on Western government are just absolutely enormous, when you kind of look at the welfare warfare states, so you can see it, you know, really getting stressed with the war in Ukraine, you see the loss of the currency reserve status of the US dollar, where more and more countries are trading and their own local currencies internationally, and the rise of BRICS. So we're moving into this multipolar world, and especially for people that, you know, are dependent on the reserve status in the US dollar, this is going to have an impact on Americans where we've been shielded from inflation in a way that, you know, the smaller economies haven't, I think that's going to be a very rude awakening. What I'm hoping that we'll see over time is that we're going to see more interest from foreign central banks in this technology. So you know, you look at Zimbabwe or Venezuela, you have countries and these foreign central banks that are interested in circulating gold, because their fiat currencies have failed, and they're making these tiny, tiny little gold coins and it's like they want to go back in time, but you kind of can't. You know, I mean, part of the problem with a gold standard Word is, you know, most of our copper now is used in electrical wiring. Right our silver is used in solar panels, the gold standard was a tri metal system, you had 100 copper pennies as one silver dollars 20 silver dollars to a gold piece. And the reason why to get to your earlier point is gold wasn't usable for small things. You had to use silver and copper. Right. But if you go back in time, if you go back 100 years, the purchasing power of a gold back in 1923 would have been for wheat pennies. Yeah. You know, so really, you know, gold backs aren't about replacing silver. I mean, they replace coppers role in the economy as being a money for small transactions. Although I think it's at 50. You could maybe say it's kind of more like say, Whoa, stuff. So you mentioned brick, so I'm suspecting that you're paying attention to what's happening in this emerging multipolar world. This is I can hear me too. And there's a term they call our five just because the BRICS countries currencies all started with the letter R. And I'm kind of curious, it's a maybe slightly off topic a little bit, but you mentioned it, you know, these new emerging powers are looking for ways to have currency or offer currency that is backed by something right. And so I'm kind of curious what you think about a digital currency, maybe called our five that is backed by commodities, including gold, silver, lithium, those kinds of things, what's your thought on that? You know, we used to do that, and it was called the US dollar. Up until 1971, you know, you have these, you know, paper dollars, but don't worry, they're backed by a commodity, they're backed by gold. And you know, central banks can redeem it. And, you know, what happens is in a low accountability environment, is the backing tends to disappear. And it really erodes trust. Now, central banks, they do own about half of the investment grade gold in the world, what I'm hoping that we see is that, you know, they'll look at this kind of technology where we're using gold backs, and they'll say, Hey, this is a way that we can double the value of our gold by, you know, breaking it down into 1000 pieces, but also have a circulating currency cash that is going to have value no matter what, if they're serious about doing a sound money, I think we're gonna see this technology emerge. And I think the major powers that adopt it first, you know, are going to enrich their civilizations the fastest. Yeah I think you said something really profound and important, because on the one hand, and I don't know, to what extent even Americans are that aware, but in Europe, which I'm from Heritage pretty closely connected, several of the bigger countries in Europe have suggested to get rid of cash. And that was like, like, literally like COVID, pulling the cork out of a champagne bottle, it erupted in protests, and people basically said, I want to have something tangible. So I think going back is a great opportunity in that direction. On the other hand, I could I'm just giving you my opinion about the same question is, I can imagine digital currency based on the blockchain so that you have actually the truth in the transaction. And then commodity base, the part that would be the interesting part is how do you verify that the actual commodity component is really there? Right? And there are plenty of people you will being an expert and go to say, Okay, I wish anybody could show me how much God is really important ox or I'm actually being a professional skeptic. I'm always saying, if that were the same thing that just happened with Silicon Valley Bank, on gold ETFs, would we find out how many of these ETS actually have to go whether they have been selling people either digitally, or in some sort of piece of paper, or some kind of sort of piece of statement? So I'm not so sure about that. I'm skeptical that the ETS really have the gold that they claim to backup. I know the road say they have to, but you know, the proof is in the pudding. Yeah, we'll find out, you might be asking the right questions here. Yeah, exactly what you and I need to stay in touch. So we can maybe, you know, smile together when it all kind of comes together in that way. And then well, in some way, I think we did the times the stability that we were used to, I would say between 90 and 50 stability in the sense of the system, and probably 2020 is over and there's something new is coming. I'm a big fan of the book, the fourth turning because it basically uses this analogy of the seasons. And I am sure personally that we are currently in winter, and nobody knows what the new spring is gonna bring. But it's probably something going to be different than what we have been used to. So with all of that being said, we always have two questions at the end of the show. So the first one is, if you could meet anybody, Jeremy, past or present, who would it be? And why? No, that's a good question. You know, right. Now, I would say Thomas Jefferson. Okay, I think he would be a really interesting person to meet and get his, I guess perspective on, you know, his vision for America. Yeah, I think I think it'd be fun for and I'm allowed to talk to these historical figures about what's going on. Yeah absolutely I mean I would come with you. And I would encourage you, Jeremy constantly to tell him, here is what came before you. What do you guys put together in the Constitution? What do you think about This is what happened with the Louisiana Purchase? Yeah, yeah. You know, I mean, I guess if it's could be anybody, and maybe I'd meet Christ, you know, that kind of, Yeah but Jefferson is a good one, especially. For me, I just recently wrote an article about it to say, Okay, people that came to the United States are what we call America now, mainly to flee from feudalism. And when you look at how it was described, and what we have now, it's almost like full circle, right? So it's kind of weird, though. The last question, Jeremy, is, if you had a time machine, you could go anywhere, you're not supposed to change history or the future, but you could go anywhere, and where would you go in life? You know, it's, I think that I think it'd be a lot of fun. You have all the time in the world to figure that out? Right? Yeah, totally. It goes to the dinosaurs, right? And now you can go any time period, I think it'd be very dangerous time traveling, you know, because anywhere you go, you're not really going to fit in, you know, and Yeah that's true. I'm looking for myself. And it's, I'm asking this question, every time we have a show, I have more and more come to appreciate the opportunity to observe, I would really like to see if the story about those who actually gave the shovels to the Gold Rush people in California, were so much better off than those who were digging in the ground. Right? Or that challenger catastrophe as an aviator, you know, if the group thing that ultimately was diagnosed to be the reason why they launched way out of the specification of the vehicle, and then were supposedly surprised that it blew up, did that really happen not to interfere? But I would really be curious Even if you go back in time, you know, people, you know, they say, you know, the past is so muddy, you know, the past is so muddy, because there's so many, you know, the the History is written by the winners? Well, I think if you were to go to the past, it'd be a lot like the present where there's so much going on, there's so much noise, even if you're there, it's hard to really fully understand what's going on all the time. Oh, yeah, absolutely. Although I'm kind of curious, from a different observer perspective, with our capability of living in an environment that has this enormous amount of influence information flowing into our brains on a consistent basis, other than when we sleep, you go back 100 years and take away all of that stuff that enables this flow of information with somebody like you and I just observing, say, man, there's nothing going on. Because, you know, like, a letter takes a week or something like that. So Yeah life moves slower back then, you know, you have to worry about different things, you know, you had to worry about lice. And you had to worry about dysentery and you know, public sanitation and horse feces on the road. And, you know, I think we actually haven't really good now, you know, I entered, I enjoyed a standard of living that the kings have old, the envious of, you know, so it's hard to imagine doing anything more than just visiting the past. You know, and you know, you're gonna be around people that are dressing different and speaking different. And I think even being an observer would be challenging just because you'd stick out like a sore thumb to play put a costume on us. And I might, I might be overthinking it. You know, I mean, in the past, I mean, I don't know. But Yeah, exactly. Well, I'm also thinking, you know, like when we go to Jefferson, like you mentioned, right, these guys, in my opinion, literally had more time, just because exchange of information was so much slower to come up with that lasts for 200 years. I don't know that we are anything nowadays that we can really have a reasonable expectation to still be of equal or even similar value and 200 years from now. Yeah, that one definitely got better. I think if you buried your wallet, and you had some gold backs in it, yeah. And they and they dug it up in 1000 years, they'd say, Oh my gosh, he has gold backs in his wallet. Everything else would have rotted to garbage. Yeah, see if x city just when you said that, the story of a tea. Have you ever heard the story of a tea that came to my mind? It's a guy from the Neanderthal times who was found a few years ago in the Austrian Alps for all these 1000s of years, he had basically been frozen in the eyes, and they found a bunch of things and if they, you and I have that, you know, eternal if he had had a gold back and look brand new, these things, you know, the polymer coating on them? Yeah, they last for 1000s of years. Okay, I think we are we are trying to build something that No, you're good salesperson. You convince me Hopefully many in the audience the Go backs is the way to go. So how can they get in touch and maybe get some goodbacks? Yeah, they learn more at gold back.com Or a wholesaler, a lot of the major precious metals companies are selling gold backs. Now, you can find a list of them at Gold back.com Gold back leases are done through Alpine gold.com. And that's where you can buy gold backs and get a return on it. That might be a great option. If you're finding that gold backs are sold out right now we're having a hard time keeping them in stocks. That's the way you can get a lot of gold backs and get a return on them. Okay, I just realized I lied. I have actually one more question, if you don't mind. And that is you set up the gold back with the artwork about states. And I saw Wyoming and Utah and so forth. So I Oh, can you say when other states are coming out? You know, 90% of our gold back sales occur outside of those four states? because gold is money everywhere. Yeah, just for the awkward for the artwork, you know, we are releasing about one state a year, you know, and we're talking about possibly doing like Limited Edition series of other states just to get them out faster, you know, or you're getting them but they're graded or they're in frames or you know, something like that. So, you know, that might be something we started doing. And yeah, maybe 2025 or 2024. Right? Yeah, I was not thinking so much from a valuation of the artboard. itself. But just you know, there's a certain attachment to where you are, with your, you know, the two states, I've lived in the United States for 30 years, basically, when New Mexico in California, if they were available over the others, I would probably get them from those states. Right. All right, cool. Jeremy, it was awesome. I mean, I didn't know until I prepared for the show that there is actually a modern way in go to exchange to go and buy stuff and pay with gold banks get a leasing program, get me to earn it. So it's really awesome on the stuff that you do. And I think you're right that the volatility and in the marketplace will make it even more necessary to have both bags and gold coins and silver coins and other value assets. Well, hey, thank you. I appreciate that a lot. Yeah, thank you. And I'm glad that you could make it even though somebody stole you an hour of your life, you know, so Times are changing. All right. Thank you so much. And maybe we can do it again. Okay. All right. Take care. Bye Thanks for listening. And I hope you enjoyed today's episode of the The IDEAL Investor Show more info and the links we mentioned during the show in the show notes or you can go to our website at IDEO redcross.com and sign up for the Apple podcast link. And if you'd like to talk to me sign up for strategy call. Hopefully you want to share what you learned with your network and bring more people in we are really eager to hear your comments and until next time, be well stay safe and ciao.